# starting a web business - Page 2

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## Re: starting a web business

Let's see - you come in here asking questions that are so broad and general
that we can't even begin to answer, then get an attitude when we try to
explain why we can't answer and claim that you're "a professor in computer
science" and can do better than most hacks, and when asked to prove it, you
get even more of an attitude.

Based on that, I'd say that:

a) you are, indeed, a professor of computer science. You have the
appropriate poor level of social skills and the associated misplaced
arrogance, which make you come across more like a whiny adolescent wannabe
computer geek who spends too much time locked in his room playing MMORPGs
and not enough time getting out and learning about the real world.
b) your skills are, indeed, what one would expect of a such a person.

## Re: starting a web business

Tony wrote:

You all keep bringing up the professor thing.  I only told you all I was
a professor because some one asked what i do.  I don't like giving my
info out over the net.

What the hell is a MMORPGs?  You know, regardless of if I am a "newbie"
on the group, you all need to realize in order to receive respect, you
must give it, otherwise, I will keep calling you out like the bitch you
are.

thank you!  come again!

## Re: starting a web business

Doug wrote:

Physician - heal thyself!  Do you always go into new places and defecate
on the floor?

## Re: starting a web business

Matt-the-Hoople wrote:

Look, I'm really sorry.  I didn't mean to insult every one...  It's just
difficult for me when people want to automatically make the assumption
that I don't know what I'm talking about.

The computer thing is what I do, and I have always been very good at it.
I don't feel like I should have to deal with a bunch of crap

There are plenty of people who come on here just to boost their ego by
trying to prove that they are better/smarter than the next guy. That's
probably all they do all day.  I'm not big on that. I just like to keep
it simple.  If I know the answer to a question, I'll try to help some
one out.  If that person is misguided, I will try to tell them what
direction to go in.

Since this is the summer, and I don't have as many classes to teach, i
thought i would try to make some income some place else.  That's all.  I
do know how to design web pages.  Maybe not as good as some, but when
comparing to the people I know who do web pages for money, I'm pretty
good.  People may believe me or not.  I don't care.  I just wanted to

## Re: starting a web business

Doug wrote:

No-one said that...You assumed that...

Then you are in good company here....

If you had been a little more specific with your original question, then
no-one would have needed to ask you for further information....
crap....

Kind of like when you said "I can assure you that I am far beyond the
capabilities of most hacks." ?

Except for when you said "I can assure you that I am far beyond the
capabilities of most hacks." ?

Have you ever encountered a situation where you needed a person to

And we just wanted to see an example of your work....Thats all....What's
wrong with that?....

--
www.fixaphoto.co.uk
for photographic restorations

## Re: starting a web business

Fat Sam wrote:

and

"a  grasp of trivial site building techniques is apparently beyond the
capabilities of most hacks"

That has no use to me at all in answering my question.  I don't like to
have to prove myself, if you'll notice, in my first post i wasn't trying
to brag... But, apparently I have to in order to get a question answered!

I'm just saying, even if I am not ready, hell, say something to put me
on the right track!  The other stuff is unnecessary.

## Re: starting a web business

Doug wrote:

<play nice mode />

Contracts -

Contracts vary, but the philosophy is the same.  How you set it up is
entirely up to you.  Consulting with an attorney is best.

The basics are:

Define the scope of the project
How / how much will you charge
How do you expect to be paid (eg 33% up front ... blah blah)
When will you deliver finished work

There is, of course, much more to it.  IIRC wilsonweb.com had some good
sample contracts, but that was years ago.  Again - consult with an
attorney - they are best able to advise you.  It's worth spending some
money as opposed to getting pooched.

What to charge -

There is only one answer, and only you can provide it.  What is your
time worth to you, and how does that balance against your skill set?
Whittle from there - YMMV.

Oh - and welcome to AWW.

<insufferable bastard mode />

## Re: starting a web business

As someone who has spent the last 15 years self-employed, I can say with
certainty that if you have to ask very rudimentary questions about a

BTW, I wasn't joking about checking with the Business department of your
college. Many colleges have an "Entrepreneur's Club" or something similar -
I've gotten a LOT of good advice there. Also, you may want to check out some
suggest "Small Time Operator" as a good starting point.

## Re: starting a web business

Doug,

how much of your time have you wasted today on this thread?

from this NG as your SP gives you and spend a day looking for rellevant
posts that seem on topic for you. then identify those who speak to your
concerns. then go visit their websites, read everything on them and follow
every link. i'd definately go for Grey's, i'd hit Bokama's, Tasso's and i
think i made mine just for people like you. and be nice to these guys, they
can show you the way if they want to.

that will keep you busy and let you know the scope of the game. from there
all you need to do is figure out how to charge for all those activities and
that only comes after the bite the big one a couple of times.

trevor

## Re: starting a web business

trevor wrote:

not much... this is easy.

## Re: starting a web business

And, IMO, you're actually redeeming yourself rather well.

Yeah, I know the feeling. I get it all the time because I'm a "computer
programmer" and I don't have a degree.

Yep.

Problem is, you took a request for a URL as "a bunch of crap", it seems -
and realistically, it wasn't. No matter what you TELL the group, how does
anyone know that you really DO know how to do web design, without seeing
of your skills would be useful.

Right - and we get to see the result of those people who do web pages for
money & don't know what they're doing all the time. I'm doing some
customization of a commercial PHP ad script that a company SELLS, and I'm
thouroughly amazed at how crappy the coding is.

Again, though - welcome to the group. You've had a bumpy start, but I see
you beginning to fit in :)

## Re: starting a web business

Tony wrote:

I sometimes think that that's the rule rather than an exception. Commercial
stuff is often an idea, that is coded and sold. Making it perfect takes so
much time that it never will be finished :-)

Sometimes I think that's the main reason why I am not selling ready made
solutions :-)

--
John                       Perl SEO tools: http://johnbokma.com/perl/
Experienced (web) developer: http://castleamber.com/
Get a SEO report of your site for just 100 USD:
http://johnbokma.com/websitedesign/seo-expert-help.html

You know, there's not-perfect, and there's crap. This one is crap, IMO.

Just as one example:
In many places, the code needs to call various SQL queries. A lot of these
queries are called using code like:

$sql = "SELECT * FROM table WHERE 1";$res = mysql_query($sql); But in many other places, the query is called using code like:$res = q("SELECT * FROM table WHERE 1");

and q() is a function that runs mysql_query() and returns the result -
nothing more.

Best I can tell, these differences are completely random. I suspect that
someone finally just got tired of typing "mysql_query" over and over, and
made a function. Of course, they never bothered to change any of the earlier
uses.

And let's not even get into the difficulty you would have if you wanted to
use a database other than MySQL...

Actually, I'm speculating as to whether it may be a good idea to get into :)

Tony wrote:

[ selling programs ]

I still say no to myself :-)

--
John                       Perl SEO tools: http://johnbokma.com/perl/
Experienced (web) developer: http://castleamber.com/
Get a SEO report of your site for just 100 USD:
http://johnbokma.com/websitedesign/seo-expert-help.html

## Re: starting a web business

$M36.1065@newsread1.news.atl.earthlink.net: Massive Multiplayer Online Role-Playing Games. The online worlds which the internet has turned into a profitable business. Im not sure what answers they might have for you. The questions you asked were reasonable but Im not sure there has been any settling in on them. Ive seen web pages done for thousands of dollars which looked like they were just the example templates from a book, and Ive seen pages 10 times that good done by high school kids for the price of a McDonalds burger. Ongoing maintenance can be a good thing to add but I wouldnt. Im too "instructive" for that to work well. Ive seen people charge$100/month to
do ongoing maintenance until the customer finally figured out they could
do it themselves. Id rather just show them how to do it themselves. I
think its more honest to keep the lines of communication open and charge
per update. You can cut-rate that since its far easier for you to changes
than for someone from the outside try to edit your pages. Especially if

Alot of this would be variable on skills. HTML, XML, CSS, PHP, SQL,
linux, windows, mac... graphics logo work included? sound? flash
animations?

If I were motivated to start a web business I think I would cash in on
the "heard of it but do I need it" crowd. Snag a domain for the local
area, put a map up. Go door-to-door with a laptop (or hire some kids to
do it). Show the map, click on a shop and it brings up a basic web page.
CLick on their shop and... nothing. "I can fix that. For as little as
X.XX/month you can have 24/7 advertising. Compare that to the \$600 for a
newspaper ad that they wrap fish in the next day. Im not sure how many
using the yellow pages.. but then, how many would it take to make this
worthwhile?". Some pitch like that. Heck you can ask for a business card
or a flyer, scan it in, its a page. Wait for them to ask for something
fancier.

Gandalf  Parker
--
Too many ideas, too little motivation

## Re: starting a web business

Gandalf Parker wrote:

thanks!

## Re: starting a web business

Forging a path through the Usenet jungle, armed only with a rusty
Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.7.2) Gecko/20040804
Netscape/7.2 (ax), Doug stumbled into alt.www.webmaster and said:

Gentlemen, please note that even though it may appear (from behind the
screen) that there is a 'me/I' and 'we/us/them' on Usenet, there is
actually no such thing.

bumpy landings on Usenet are not a new phenomenon (you'll get over it) but
lying won't win many friends - ask Fcuk-face whassisname[1], the little
shit that can't make up his mind if he's running a hosting company or just
pimping for one.

[1] he has so many, it's difficult to keep track
--
Whatever you do - do something.

## Re: starting a web business

William Tasso wrote:

send me your address, and i'll send you an application packet and a
personal invitation to enroll.    You could take a few classes in the
Fall. ;)

## Re: starting a web business

Forging a path through the Usenet jungle, armed only with a rusty
Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.7.2) Gecko/20040804
Netscape/7.2 (ax), Doug stumbled into alt.www.webmaster and said:

well fcuk me sideways - I've scored ;)

--
Whatever you do - do something.

## Re: starting a web business

William Tasso wrote:

huh?