BSOD only iwth more RAM

Do you have a question? Post it now! No Registration Necessary.  Now with pictures!

Threaded View
Compaq  8510p with Vista business.  Recenly it shows a BSOD on
shutdown. The Mem dump says "no more system PTEs" caused by
ntkrnlpa.exe. This also happens in safe mode.

I changed the Registry value of SystemPages to maximum. Still no Good.

If I  reduce the RAM to only 1G, it shuts down OK !! Once I put in 2G
or more it has the above problem. Any clue??

Thanks

ABC


Re: BSOD only iwth more RAM

On 10/22/2011 7:59 AM, ABC wrote:
Quoted text here. Click to load it

When you say "once i put in 2G or more," are you referring to adding in
the *same* memory module?  Could you possibly have a bad stick of RAM?

Re: BSOD only iwth more RAM

wrote:

Quoted text here. Click to load it

The laptop has 2 slots. This is what happens:

1G          no BSOD
1g+2G       BSOD
2G            BSOD
2G+2G     BSOD

The RAMs are OK. I even bought some new Kingston RAMs to try and got
the same results. Mind you, with more RAM than 1G  the comupter is
notably faster. It works fine, except for the shutdown.

Would you think this is a windows problem??

ABC




Re: BSOD only iwth more RAM

ABC wrote:
Quoted text here. Click to load it

There are a few details missing. The laptop comes with 32 bit and 64 bit
versions of
the OS (as install media). If there was a 32 bit version of Vista installed, then
maybe you did something like this ? This changes the virtual address space split.
It's possible that with reduced kernel address space, the PTE error is related to
that (an attempt to tune the OS).

http://blogs.technet.com/b/brad_rutkowski/archive/2006/10/03/hey-where-did-_2f00_3gb-go-in-longhorn-and-vista_3f00_.aspx

If you're using a 64 bit OS, or you haven't been modifying the 32 bit one with
IncreaseUserVa, I found a suggestion here, for setting a debugging variable
which is supposed to translate the BSOD into a different BSOD, and in
the process, it is supposed to "name" the driver doing it. The reason for
setting this, is on the theory that some driver is causing the screwup,
rather than IncreaseUserVa.

http://web.archive.org/web/20090113085524/http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-gb/library/ms793941.aspx

   "HKLM\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Control\Session Manager\Memory
Management\TrackPtes
    equal to DWORD 1, and reboot"

HTH,
      Paul

Re: BSOD only iwth more RAM


Quoted text here. Click to load it

This is 32 bit vista

I used bluescreenview to check the Mdump, I used Verifier to track the
BSOD.

Mem dump:-

NO_MORE_SYSTEM_PTES
0x0000003f    0x00000000    0x00000010    0x000008e1 0x00000000
ntkrnlpa.exe    ntkrnlpa.exe+7fe73    
ntkrnlpa.exe+7fe73    ntkrnlpa.exe+7fa14    ntkrnlpa.exe+6bcd3    
SafeBoot.sys+833f

The drivers found the the crash stack included:

ecache.sys    
hal.dll            
Ntfs.sys    stem    
ntkrnlpa.exe    
partmgr.sys            
SafeBoot.sys        
volmgr.sys    
volsnap.sys    

Verifier reported the offending driver as "SafeBoot.sys"

None of these makes too much sense because the machine works (slower)
and shuts down fine with 1G of RAM.

I tweaked the Registry and set the SystemPage to ffffffff. Same
result. So I do not think it was actually short of PTEs.

Help

ABC

Re: BSOD only iwth more RAM

ABC wrote:
Quoted text here. Click to load it

And if you locate the actual SafeBoot.sys file, is the ownership actually HP
rather than Microsoft ? According to this, that is part of some HP software.

http://techask.com/help/windows-xp/c-windows-system32-safeboot-sys-corrupt-6204.html

If you know the name of the HP Security Suite, perhaps you could Google on
that for some additional info.

The file itself could be sitting in a Windows system folder, but the rest
of the Suite could be sitting in some HP folder. Doing a "Properties" on the
file, maybe it has ownership info.

*******

Someone with similar symptoms. Unfortunately, he didn't post back with
an update on whether it was resolved or not.

http://www.winvistatips.com/vista-safeboot-sys-causing-bsod-no_more_system_ptes-3f-t196134.html

*******

Be careful. Safeboot looks dangerous.

https://community.mcafee.com/thread/1160?start=0&tstart=0

I wonder if there is an update for the (HP edition) of Safeboot drive encryption
?

    Paul

Re: BSOD only iwth more RAM



Quoted text here. Click to load it

Great Info. Thanks
 I have HP proect Tool Security Manager v.3.00. There is an update
version of 4.10 on HP's site.

Question is should I remove the current Protect Tool totally, or just
update----in case the HP would not allow its machine to run without
the security software, and the Update may not give me  a better
SafeBoot.sys?

ABC




Re: BSOD only iwth more RAM

ABC wrote:
Quoted text here. Click to load it

Maybe it isn't clear to you yet.

You received a laptop. It's a business laptop, with the ability to encrypt the
disk.
If you take a business trip, and the laptop is stolen, tools like HP ProtectTools
are there, to protect the information on the disk. (In some cases,
employees are mandated by government regulations, to protect
the info on the laptop, which is why HP provides that kind
of software. To make the laptop attractive to companies who
need that kind of protection.)

That means things like encryption could be used.

The software undoubtedly "nagged" you about configuring it. Why ? It's a lot
like owning a firearm.

If you don't configure it, now, imagine if an "evil co-worker" gets their
hands on the laptop while you're away from your desk, and "configures" it
for you, setting a password. Suddenly, you can't get into the laptop any
more. And without the password, or without backup files, it may be impossible
to access it again.

If you do configure it, and the tool set involved encryption, then you
must learn the "best practices" for it. For example, you must back up
all "keys" or "passwords". If you don't do that, some relatively
trivial changes could make your data in-accessible. Things like
resetting the TPM chip. Or changing the hard drive serial number
(replace drive when it fails). These are the kinds of things, that
you must have made backup copies of all keys and passwords. Without
them, you could lose access to the hard drive.

HP has various manuals for ProtectTools, and in there, you should be
investigating how to backup keys and passwords. This probably isn't the
right manual, but I include a link to it, so you can see how complicated
this is.

http://bizsupport1.austin.hp.com/bc/docs/support/SupportManual/c01528160/c01528160.pdf

It's a "damned if you don't / damed if you do" situation. You cannot
move quickly, to resolve the problem. You must be methodical, You
must use the best practices. Or, it'll be a matter of reinstalling
Windows and starting all over again from the factory defaults.
All your user data files gone etc.

Now, if you go to update the software, the theory is, nothing bad
should happen. Any configuration files should be preserved. But
you never know, perhaps the version contains a bug. What would you
do, if suddenly, you couldn't access the hard drive any more, and
could not boot ?

That's why I can't just go around offering advice like "sure,
just whip that update in there". I know "firearms are involved",
I can warn you of the dangers, but it's your responsibility to know:

1) What features you enabled.
    1a) What dangers await, if you don't enable features or don't set passwords,
        such that an "evil person" doesn't set them for you. Passwords
        are not a problem, if they can be easily reset. A "hardened" piece
        of computing hardware, is merciless, and can very easily deny you,
        the legit owner, from getting to your data.
2) If features are enabled in ProtectTools, what are the "best practices"
    for backing up "keys" or "passwords", such that your data can always
    be recovered. Even if the hard drive serial number changes, or some
    joker resets your TPM chip. I have to give the same advice to people
    who use BitLocker or EFS, as they have the ability to "shoot the user
    in the foot" as well. I'm not an expert on these things, but I have
    run into a few users, who have managed to lose access to encrypted
    data.

If you've taken all the necessary precautions, then you can try installing
the updated ProtectTools. I don't see anything in the release notes,
to suggest they know about your problem.

If HP still provides you with support for this laptop, maybe you
could drop them an email or phone them, and see if they know about
this problem or not.

This could be an interaction, between safeboot.sys, and some other
software you've installed on the computer. But because I can't find
any relevant references to "ProtectTools" and "PTEs", I can't see what
that software or interaction that might be.

    Paul

Re: BSOD only iwth more RAM

will try to update the security suite and report back

ABC



Quoted text here. Click to load it


Re: BSOD only iwth more RAM


Solved

Remember that there was no BSOD if  I use no more than 1G of RAM.
Something to do with memory---may be even virtual memory.

So I set pagefile to manual--0.5 to 1.5 time of RAM---no more BSOD.


ABC


Quoted text here. Click to load it

Re: BSOD only iwth more RAM



ABC wrote:
Quoted text here. Click to load it

What do you mean the RAMs are OK?

What testing did you do that didn't involve just a PC?

What brands of chips are they, including the Kingstons?  Because if
the chips aren't marked with their actual manufacturers' logos or full
part numbers, most likely they're inferior, even factory rejects, and
with one model of DIMMs, most of the samples I tried were bad.

I can't think of anything but the CPU heatsink needing to be blown
out.


Re: BSOD only iwth more RAM

Quoted text here. Click to load it

Do you know for sure that the laptop can handle a 2GB RAM module? Perhaps
2GB total (2x1GB) is its limit - you only see the BSODs when you use the 2GB
modules. Have you tried 2x1GB modules?

Quoted text here. Click to load it



Site Timeline