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Subject Author Date
Hard Drive Password Problems groupware 02-03-2007
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Posted by Rod Speed on February 6, 2007, 1:30 am
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>>> Rod Speed wrote

>>>>> Unfortunately it costs to get copies of the ATA specs from
>>>>> http://www.t13.org/

>>>> The drafts are readily available for free and that detail didnt change.

>>> They are?

>> Yep.

>>> Got a URL for the free copy of the full specs for all ATA revisions?

>> I never said anything about all ATA revisions.

>>> What I see at
>>> http://www.t13.org/Standards/Default.aspx?DocumentType=3&DocumentStage=2
>>> is a list (but no links for them) and the comment "Copies of
>>> published standards may be purchased from: ANSI, ...". Where are the free
copies then?

>> http://www.t13.org/Documents/Default.aspx?DocumentType=4&DocumentStage=2
>> http://www.t13.org/Documents/Default.aspx?DocumentType=4&DocumentStage=1

> I was asking about the actual ratified and approved specifications, not drafts
of proposals for
> those specs.

I already told you that that detail didnt change significantly
between the draft and the ratified standard.

And the later drafts include the ratified standard too.

> I don't believe "drafts" are the actual standard.

You have always been, and always will be, completely and
utterly irrelevant. What you may or may not believe in spades.

> I had asked about getting the standards spec.

And I told you how to see those for free, most obviously when a
later draft includes the earlier ratified detail on the security mode.

Not ever a single mention of the drive doing any encryption, which
is all that is needed to prove that you have never had a clue.

> I didn't realizer you were pointing at a list that contained some drafts that
proposed those
> specs. Some entries are just 2-page descriptions or placeholders, hardly what
would be called a
> standard specification.

Pity about the other ones that cover that security mode completely.

> Some are docs containing corrections, so hardly a specification.

Pity about the other ones that cover that security mode completely.

> Some are just entries in the table listing but with no link to an actual doc.

Pity about the other ones that cover that security mode completely.

> The specs still cost money.

Not when a later draft includes that ratified spec they dont.

Rule of Holes, child. When you are in one STOP DIGGING.



Posted by Vanguard on February 6, 2007, 9:44 pm
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 Thanks for verifying that the real specs for the standards cost money.

Posted by Rod Speed on February 7, 2007, 12:06 am
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> Thanks for verifying that the real specs for the standards cost money.

No they dont when you have enough of a clue to read the NEXT draft
that includes what was PREVIOUSLY ratified and you can see that
nothing changed with the bit you are interested from THAT draft.

Rule of Holes, child. When you are in one STOP DIGGING.



Posted by Folkert Rienstra on February 6, 2007, 2:50 pm
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> > > Rod Speed wrote
> >
> > > > > Unfortunately it costs to get copies of the ATA specs from
> > > > > http://www.t13.org/
> >
> > > > The drafts are readily available for free and that detail didnt
> > > > change.
> >
> > > They are?
> >
> > Yep.
> >
> > > Got a URL for the free copy of the full specs for all ATA revisions?
> >
> > I never said anything about all ATA revisions.
> >
> > > What I see at
> > > http://www.t13.org/Standards/Default.aspx?DocumentType=3&DocumentStage=2
> > > is a list (but no links for them) and the comment "Copies of
> > > published standards may be purchased from: ANSI, ...".
> > > Where are the free copies then?
> >
> > http://www.t13.org/Documents/Default.aspx?DocumentType=4&DocumentStage=2
> > http://www.t13.org/Documents/Default.aspx?DocumentType=4&DocumentStage=1

> I was asking about the actual ratified and approved specifications,

Which obviously will wildly deviate from the last draft just before they
applied the stamp of approval to it.

> not drafts of proposals for those specs. I don't believe "drafts" are
> the actual standard. I had asked about getting the standards spec.

Idjut.

> I didn't realizer you were pointing at a list that contained some drafts
> that proposed those specs. Some entries are just 2-page descriptions or
> placeholders, hardly what would be called a standard specification.
> Some are docs containing corrections, so hardly a specification. Some
> are just entries in the table listing but with no link to an actual doc.
> The specs still cost money.

Posted by Odie Ferrous on February 3, 2007, 4:32 pm
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Vanguard wrote:
>
> > Re: "The other half of the hash (to decode) was back in the original
> > laptop. Preventing someone from getting at it, especially by stealing
> > the drive, is just what that security is for; i.e., unless the drive
> > is in the original laptop that hashed up the drive's contents AND you
> > know the password, you will never get at the decoded contents of the
> > drive."
> >
> > I don't think that's correct. This isn't windows,
>
> I don't care what OS is on the drive, encrypted or not. The whole-disk
> encryption is performed in hardware. Half of that support is on the
> hard drive, the other half is back in the mobo. If the drive wanders
> off from the mobo that hashed up the drive, that drive cannot be
> decoded. It is very similar to e-mail encryption: the source (owner of
> the certificate or the mobo) has the "private" portion and the target
> (recipient or hard drive) has the "public" portion. Without both,
> there's no decryption, and the source controls that.

Vanguard,


All the drive manufacturers have their own method of enforcing password
protection at this level.

Some of them can be overcome quite easily (for instance, a typical
resurrection for Western Digital drives is to enter, as the password,
WDC repetitively for 32 characters) whereas others (most) require
hardware intervention.

We can recover / obliterate passwords for almost all drives - using
specialist equipment - but for the lucky user of a WD-type drive, it's
fairly straightforward.

The password is rarely stored on multiple media - as far as I can tell
with up-to-date information and experience. (i.e. it's never stored as a
combination of platter-based info (system area) and hardware (BIOS / ROM
/ NVRAM.)



--
Retrodata
www.retrodata.co.uk
Globally Local Data Recovery Experts

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